Stop shooting messengers and face the truth

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/guest_contributors/article6952298.ece

[quote]December 11, 2009

Stop shooting messengers and face the truth
Sometimes knowledge is uncomfortable. But it is the mark of a civilised society that we do not sweep it under the carpet

In 413BC a traveller sat down in a barber’s shop in Piraeus, the Athenian port, and readied himself for a shave. He commiserated with the locals for the loss of their recent military expedition to Syracuse. The horror dawned; the traveller was first with the news. The barber flung down his tools and ran to the city, crying the news. His reward? The Athenians refused to believe that their navy had been destroyed, that their sons and brothers were dead or working as slaves in Sicilian mines. As Plutarch tells us, the barber was “fastened to the wheel and racked”.

This is how we so often treat those who tell us the truth we do not want to hear. History is littered with examples of messengers being shot, tortured and pilloried, literally and metaphorically.

To quote Sophocles’ Antigone: “No one loves the messenger who brings bad news.” To misquote Corporal Jones: “We don’t like it up us.”

We assume that we are different from our forefathers; more tolerant and more willing to allow uncomfortable truths to be aired. We have a liberal democracy and we congratulate ourselves on a commitment to freedom of speech. Yet when the truth sits uncomfortably with our notions of what is right, when it clashes with our dearly held notions of tolerance, we are as squeamish as any of our ancestors. Few are as intolerant as the self-consciously tolerant.[/quote]

The article above is about crime in the U.K. but it could just as easily been about trying to get the truth out about Gang Stalking and the fact that people in most time periods do not like people who tell them the truth, or who preach something that goes against their orthodoxy. What I am learning about this time period is that it is no better, in fact it’s worst, because unlike other times, we have so much wonderful and rich history to fall back on, and yet in many ways we are just as ignorant.

[quote]
This is how we so often treat those who tell us the truth we do not want to hear. History is littered with examples of messengers being shot, tortured and pilloried, literally and metaphorically.

To quote Sophocles’ Antigone: “No one loves the messenger who brings bad news.” To misquote Corporal Jones: “We don’t like it up us.”
[/quote]

Sorry if the message is not what you want to hear, truth is a bitter pill to swallow at times. For me I loved my country, I thought I lived in the best place on earth (literally). It took me a really long time of grappling with the betrayal I felt to come to the semi-full realization of some truth. I don’t think I have the full truth, I am not sure I could handle the full truth just yet, but I have tried to educate myself on some of the recent history, the stuff that the text book does not tell you, some of the not so hidden conspiracy, and it’s one shock to the system after another.

Sometimes I get angry with people for being so stupid and gullible, for believing the best, but I was right there a few short years ago, and without my targeting, it would have taken me a very long time to believe anything bad about my country, or my fellow citizens. I always thought of us as the good guys, that we would never ever do what was done in East Germany or other places. I was so naive, so desperately wrong, luckily for me truth is easier to swallow when you have the burn marks, bruises, and psychological torture to show for it. Without this, I might still be trying to believe that my country was not doing anything bad. I might not have taken the time to research like I have, but I have now done this, and I have no intention of going back.

I don’t hate my fellow citizens, I feel sorry for them, many of them likely think that they are doing something good, trying to be good citizens like I was taught to be, but I am lucky, I have seen the dark side and I know enough history to know that what is being done is wrong. Most importantly as a target, I have seen, experienced and read about cruelty like none other, and I am quite comfortable with how I feel.

I know for some this is hard to comprehend, some really are just there to try to make the society better, but if killing the innocent is how you are going to make the society better, you are wrong. I know many don’t see it this way, the 15 to 30 minutes that they give seems like nothing and they might not see how their small roles could destroy lives, so with every story, revelation targets have tried to show you this. We have been trying to say, hey look we are innocent, in many cases good people, and something is wrong within the society cause it’s destroying our lives. Many of us naively thought that this would be enough, but we were proven wrong time and again, and worst many started to realize the long term goal of this targeting is our destruction, how could you expect us to be ok with it?

Did you think this was Stalinist Russia? Did you think that we would agree that we were bad because the state said so? The state who does some of the most hypocritical, terroristic things? Not going to happen. Most of us are good people, we do not deserve this, and we are saying that a system that would destroy us, is a broken and corrupted system. I get that some do not see it that way, but I am sorry for you, because we see it, live it and feel it on a daily basis and it does destroy lives.

In trying to expose this, we are just doing what past targets have done, would you honestly expect anything less? Don’t get upset if you have a harder time destroying our lives, it’s not our jobs to make it easier for you to do so, and how silly would you have to be to think so?

The goal of these sites is to support each other, document the stories of targets, and to highlight the sad truth, which is that our countries are becoming a nation of informants, but also to show what has happened to other societies where this was allowed to happen. The saddest part I find in researching is that when these times are happening, people always feel justified, they believe the lies, and they become so brain washed that they can not see past the lies, they have to believe the lies. They tell themseles I was just following orders. I did it cause an authority figure told me to. Anything else would mean confronting the evils of their actions, the drunken power that corrupts consistently in every time period. The comradely in these times of evil that oppressors invariably feel towards one another.

History can teach a great deal, but it’s words and facts, it is not hearts and minds, only by reaching hearts and minds can we hope to change things for the better and ensure a brighter future for ourselves and others. Believe it or not, we are not just fighting for ourselves, our main survival is key to be sure, but targets are also invariably fighting for others so that they do not have to go through and experience this horrible betrayal by the state.

I don’t know what else can be said, there are some really wrong and horrific things happening, to not draw attention to that would be neglectful at best, but it would also be a betrayal in another way. I have more incentive ofcourse, but it’s no less imperative for others to awaken to what is happening.

Also I tend to go on about us and them, us targets, those informants, but many many informants are or were targets who are broken, made to co-operate, forced, others who just gave in, and or others who were brought up this way and don’t understand the big deal. Many don’t do anything bad as far as they are aware. I don’t mean to keep separating everything, it’s really all one humanity, but as a target it’s so easy if you have a target to say, they, those are the ones doing this, at times it’s easy to forget that many of them suffered also, are suffering. I am sorry for that, but I do have my good days and bad days like everyone else.
Anyways I don’t know what else there is to say.

[quote]
We assume that we are different from our forefathers; more tolerant and more willing to allow uncomfortable truths to be aired. We have a liberal democracy and we congratulate ourselves on a commitment to freedom of speech. Yet when the truth sits uncomfortably with our notions of what is right, when it clashes with our dearly held notions of tolerance, we are as squeamish as any of our ancestors. Few are as intolerant as the self-consciously tolerant.

[/quote]

Uncomfortable truths are not fun, I have come across so many, some posted, some just hard to take, but I have consistently adjusted my comfort level cause I would rather truth than lies. I know not everyone is the same, many are happy with lies, and half truths, or flat out denial, they can not handle the fact that there could be anything bad about the society. They would silence anyone who would say otherwise, but that’s just not acceptable, because it must be said, and some of us are at the convenient place of saying it. When I say convenient, I don’t mean easy, but it’s something that needs to be done. No one is trying to make anyone feel bad, or ashamed, but I don’t know how to make people feel good when the sad truth is that their actions might be helping to kill and harm innocent people. I can just point out the facts and hope that societies conscience will have enough left to do the rest. Oh and pray.

Disinformation

http://naffoundation.org/False%20Shepherds.htm
This post is called disinfo. It’s taken from a post called false Sheppard’s from the Naff site. The common tactics have been reworked to apply to Gang Stalking, and the Targeted Individual Community.

Even as part of the community I don’t always have my hands in everything that is happening. I tend to stay away from things that I know will not move this cause forward, that will not get us the answers that we need.
1. Covert Agents will make themselves experts on Gang Stalking. People will be dependent upon them for information instead of looking for other more valid sources of information.

Eg. When I first came online I joined several groups. One group specifically had a leader that many trusted, but over time I realised this person was a what we all called perps at the time. I watched person after person trying to prove that this person was a perp to no avail. When someone would challenge this person the other agents which were most in the group, would start going, no this person is legit. I can tell you I have worked with this person for years and they are legit. Especially this one person who would always pretend to argue with this person, this second person would always come to this first persons rescue.

I watched this scenario repeated, time and time again. Each challenger beat down, and run off the forum. I learnt that it’s pointless for me to try to tell others who is a perp and who is not a perp. You have to figure it out for yourself. If you have come this far, only to be deceived by one of them, then I feel even more sorry for you. However I have been deceived by them before, so just keep questioning, and trust your instincts.
2. By being experts especially when claiming to be under attack by the bad guys, they will make legit targets feel sorry for them. They will make targets feel like we are all on the same side, but we are not. This brings targets to these experts for help and information. They see these people as trusted sources. This gives these people opportunities to continue to control targets, and harass targets. This gives these trusted people access to people, to find out their names, where they live, etc.

Eg. When I first started out, like everyone else I went looking for help. I was scared, didn’t know WTF was going on, and wanted answers. The first things they tried to do is find out my name and information. “Oh you could be a perp, we don’t know who you are, we are not giving you any information till we know more about you, we have had lot’s of perps try to infiltrate us”, etc. Being a naturally private person, they did not get a lot of details.

When they did think that they knew enough about me, they started to try to use my sensitivity against me. I was confused, because I was like what the heck? How could they all be doing this, just like offline. Cause online you expect to be in the presence of friends right? Wrong, if you can’t find people to trust offline, be just as cautious online.

The thing that accidentally clued me in, was one day this perp was having a little too much fun. I didn’t think of him as  perp at the time, but he said something to the effect of, “wouldn’t it be funny if you were in a forum full of perps and didn’t know it”? Something about that really stayed with me, and I sat back then and just observed, pretty soon after some time I began to see that he might not have been that far off, or joking. After that I started to learn. It was shortly after that, that I started to look for other answers.

The other problem with these groups is anytime someone started to suggest something that sounded reasonable, it would be shot down and only what this leader said would have validity, it went back and forth like that for some time, and I learnt.
3. These agents what they will do is use legit victims to promote other perps. Eg. A legit target thinks they have found a trusted source, they will promote that source and then get other legit targets to trust the agent and therefore giving out personal information to these people.

Eg. When I first became a target, I use to really reference the David Lawson book, and at first I was on forums going well David Lawson in his book… says this, or says that…, but I had not done the research, I just trusted what these leaders had said, because I knew nothing about disinfo agents, and all these stupid games they play. I learnt in time.

4. Control of information. This is a biggie. Some of the experts in the targeted individual community can restrict what is said. I remember when people would bring up legit topics and it was something that they did not want said, well they would suppress a topic, sometimes legit observations that other targets had made.

Also many of these agents or citizen informants you see them on YouTube, doing their best to make targets look insane, paranoid, or by making up the worst stories.

When I was on some of these sites or forums, you just knew some of the things being said didn’t sound right, but you just thought, they can’t all be perps can they? Maybe not all, but too many are, and it just brings down legit targets.

Even on normal forums, what they do is they will have specific people who’s only job it is to make the topic sound paranoid or crazy, or get legit topics banned, threads closed, or removed. Anything to make sure the correct information does not get out.

Eg. You have Covert sources on these forums going, no the government is not involved, why would the government stalk people, this is vigilante groups, I know this for a fact, cause I know who set me up for the stalking. Don’t get me wrong, you have some real targets who might believe they know who did it and from whence it came, but you also have these people spreading what sounds like just enough correct information to make the disinfo sound truthful.

5. The truth factor. Yes this is where they will spread 95% truth and then 5% disinfo, but it’s that 5% that will really screw you up. Most people will believe everything said, because you are getting truth, truth, truth, truth, truth, disinfo, truth, truth, truth. I talked about this when I saw a David Icke’s video and I said that I believed he was right about 95% of the things he had said, but I believed he was 5% telling a myth with this references to how many messiahs had existed before.

Even without that example, there is the David Lawson book, came out the same year as 9/11. Had all the information needed to sound legit, but he comes to the conclusion that it’s foreign terrorists and “anti-government” groups, who are responsible for the organised stalking? Really David? You were like a detective for 12 years, you travelled with these people for like how many years? Yet in my opinion he does not draw the right conclusion. Why is that?

Come on people think. What do you think the purpose of the book was? I have said it before and I will say it again. Either he is an agent, or he is the worst detective ever.

I believe the book is disinfo, using the 95% to 5% rule. Thanks to that book however, how many are still searching for terrorist or right wing groups as the source of their stalking? Remember not everyone has access to online groups. So many will get the book, look in the wrong place, and get themselves put in a mental hospital talking about terrorist stalking them, which I think was the purpose.
6. Yes another problem. By making themselves experts, targets get lazy. We trust them to speak for us. Depending on them to speak for us silences us, and determines the way our cause will move forward, or more importantly will not. Their goal is to keep the truth from us, and from the general public for as long as possible. We also then parrot their disinfo, so when we go to forums and talk about terrorist stalking us or whatever the lie is, then we look insane.

I keep encouraging targets, to find the leader within. Do your own research. If you are not good at research, just think. Does the information they are giving me match what I am seeing offline? Eg. The lie that this was extremist groups doing this, didn’t wash. My friends and family were involved, they may be many things, but they are not members of extremist groups. Nore were they likely to be. What they were telling me in these forums, and what I did see, when I finally went outside again did not correspond. So I researched, came up with a hypothesis, when it didn’t fully fit, I reworked it, tested it again, and then eventually the evidence matched what I was actually seeing. The pieces of the puzzle started to come together.

If the information is correct, I believed the corresponding proof would come. I think in the last week or two, a wealth of information has been found in my opinion to match what I was saying. I remember when I presented these theories on the forums, I was totally felt shot down and devalued, and I politely just left. It was not giving me the correct answers and I knew it. I more importantly knew that things were not what they seemed. For me it was the right thing to do. I can work well on my own, and if I had stayed in forums, or let others confuse me, I would not have been able to get to the correct information as quickly as I did. Trust your instincts if you have any.

7. By making them experts and our voices, they take away our power, and they move the movement forward the way they want it to go. Also if a target is about to reveal the truth, or come out with information, they will have someone on their side come out with it first, or come out with the information in greater detail. When they can no longer suppress the truth, they will tell the truth, but with their spin, and they will try to make sure that one of their people on their side is running the show.

They never just have one person. They always have several, and they will in subtle ways back each other up. I have said it before and I will say it again. I think out of let’s say 10 sites, you will find one or two that are legit, and the rest will be run by their people. That is my personal opinion, but I have my reasons for feeling this way.

They won’t all say the same thing, they will be working different angles so you will be like, well these people are doing something different, so you might feel that they are legit, but they still might not be.

8. Being an expert in some ways can be lucrative. Again the David Lawson book was the only thing the community had for some time. A lot of these people know how to work it with books, and DVD, etc. They will know how to network and how to organise better then most targets. Also they will have an agenda, if the truth is going to be disseminated on mass scale, it will be via their channels and not usually ours.

9. The agents I assume have a vested interest in making sure that the truth does not come to light. They do pose as leaders, cause we trust them to know more about the cause than we do. I mean many of them have been here before. Many of them knew about things like mind control, electronic harassment, etc.

When I came online, I looked to others, cause I didn’t know what was going on, and it was easy to truth these people. I was lucky, or maybe I don’t know, but I didn’t fall into some of the traps that I could of. Mostly I just wanted the truth about what was going on. It’s taken up so much of my time.

10. As mentioned before, they will play off of each other. Eg. They will pretend to be on separate sides, then they will both be agents. I have seen this play a dozen times. It’s confusing, cause then you are all like, ok I know this person is a perp, so the other person must be legit, not so. They can both perps.
If you are willing to see the truth, then ya it’s pretty shocking that most in the community are not what they seem. Not by a long shot. On these forums, I mean normal forums, there are people there to push down our threads when we have legit conversations about these topics. In other cases to get threads closed. In other cases to make the topic sound crazy, and to just pretend to be targets, and make other targets disbelieve the truth.

When I tell you that we are up against a system, I am not joking. Till you see, feel and experience it for yourself, you will find it hard to believe. However for your own sakes, try to see it for what it is, if you are not able to do this, then at least make sure what they are telling you matches up. Do a little bit of searching yourself.

Redeption Song

Life is a journey and you get to decide how you want to live it. We are not just physical beings, in fact I have heard it said that we are spiritual beings having a physical journey.

Life is also what you make it. So you have to choose your own paths. Targets and others alike. The hardest part for me about this crazy government targeting, was not only being targeted, but realising that others were being targeted as well. It’s bad enough what was happening to me, but to know it was happening to others was just creepy out there weird. You would think being tracked, monitored, and tortured in my home was a unique experience, but it was not. It was happening to so many others, their screams, silent alone, were also being heard somewhere across time and space. On cyberspace we finally had a chance for our collective voices and shared experiences to be heard. The collective consciousness could gather as one and borg together our experiences.

It does not change anything, but it’s given us a chance of hope, vindication, and even a chance for redemption for some. The second hardest thing for me to understand was not, only does this happen to many in society, but that some where tortured until they cracked, and became themselves these zombies that could then do the same to their own kind. That part was and still is hard for me to understand.

I mean you would get the apologies sometimes but people were still actively, and openly participating in trying to ruin and destroy my life. That was the part that was hard to understand. I mean I always thought that if you hated something for yourself you would not do it to others right? However in reading about and researching Stasi Germany I see that many others did, and probably will. That part for me is still hard to come to terms with. Targets can be targets and (Snitches) perps at the same time. Yeah I am still working on that one, mentally.

Romans 12: 9-13.
“And at that time many will fall away and will betray one another and hate one another. And many false prophets will arise, and will mislead many. And because lawlessness is increased, most people’s love will grow cold. But the one who endures to the end, it is he who shall be saved. “

Growing up it was hard to understand why neighbours would be betraying neighbours and family would betray family, of course this sort of snitch system has been used since at least the Roman time period, so it’s not hard to believe that others had seen it in play. Eg. Judas betrayal.

For the longest time in my world it was targets against the snitches. There was no way for me to see the gray areas. I mean when I  was just researching this, trying to understand how society and the world could be like this, as I was being introduced to electronic torture for the first time was a real eye opener. It still blows my mind, that you can be at home, and be tortured in your home, so much so that you wake up with burns, and your skin pealing, and then you just have to go about your day. You can have little pin sized holes burnt into your skin, and face, and then you just have to find a way to still have a normal life. Separate the two worlds so that you can function.

If I was going through this by myself it would have been hard, but being able to provide comfort to others that were going through this was helpful for me. My unheard screams were not the loudest in space anymore, others were more confused and in need of comfort and clarity than I was. Doing the site over the last year and a half, has been a journey, one that many targets were able to travel with me, while we figured out what was happening to us, while we tried to understand together how the world could be like this. To find a way to function. I admit that the jobless, at home times even with the torture did give me lot’s of time for reflection and that really helped.

I mean you live on this planet for years, and you never have any idea, any clue that the world could be like this. I didn’t I was completely clueless. I always trusted everything, and thought everything was so safe, loved my country, and trusted my government and that we were the good guys and had everyone’s best intentions at heart. I see how manipulated I was, but innocence and ignorance are an interesting mix.

http://gangstalkingworld.com/Forum/YaBB.pl?action=print;num=1201459219

Others discover the truth, with horrifying consequences. I mean who would believe that much of humanity are nothing better than slaves right? That life was a lot more like the Matrix than we realised, and that on top of that, there are other forces in the world and the universe that we know nothing about.

David Icke talks alot about other forces that control the forces that control this planet. The bible says that “For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. Ephesians 6:12″ Also on the website in 2 worlds, references are again made to other influences not of this world.

I have always been a spiritual person, I believe in spiritual things, but even as a spiritual person there is so much that I am just starting to learn now, just when you think it could not get any weirder, you learn something new everyday. However in that learning, I see that there are many others out there who can help light my way toward better understanding and for that I am grateful, and for my part I am trying to do what I can every step along the way.

Social control and conformity.

This is a post for those trying to understand how those in our society could just go along with this. How can people just give thier wills over to something this terrible?

Why is nothing being done? What you first have to realise is that if it’s not done by you or someone like you, then it will not get done at all.

You if you are reading this, and aware of what is going on are going to be one of the ones to do something, or nothing is going to be done. Anyways this post is not about revolution, it’s about trying to understand how our friends, families, co-workers, and neighbours have been co-opted by this system of control and conformity.
Let’s start with the most recent and troubling of cases. A real life case that happened in America.

Information on much of this can also be found on the http://www.TargetedIndividuals.com/Community Forum.

The Strip Search Prank Scam

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFXeXK3szOk

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strip_search_prank_call_scam

[quote]The final prank call in this scheme was made to a McDonald’s restaurant in Mount Washington, Kentucky on April 9, 2004. According to assistant manager Donna Summers, the caller identified himself as a policeman, ‘Officer Scott’, he described an employee whom he said was suspected of stealing a customer’s purse. Summers called 18-year-old employee Louise Ogborn to her office and told her of the suspicion. Following the instructions of the caller, Summers ordered Ogborn first to empty her pockets, and finally to remove all her clothing except for an apron, in an effort to find the stolen items. Again following the caller’s instructions, Summers had another employee watch Ogborn when she had to leave the office to check the restaurant. The first employee, 27 year old Jason Bradley, whom she asked to stay there refused to after he was on the phone with the caller, so she phoned her fiance Walter Nix, asking him to come in to ‘help’ with the situation. [10]

According to Ogborn, after Summers passed off the phone to Nix, he continued to do as the caller told, even as the caller’s requests became progressively more bizarre. A security camera recorded Nix forcing Ogborn to remove her apron, the only article of clothing she was still wearing, and to assume degrading positions, such as standing on a chair and getting on all fours. When Ogborn refused to obey the caller’s instructions, Nix hits the 90 lb Ogborn on the buttocks several times creating painful red welts, and at one point he does this for 10 minutes. At the caller’s request, Nix then threatens to beat Ogborn again and forces Ogborn to kiss him and then perform oral sex on him. Ogborn says at the point of sexual assault she was scarred for life.[11] The tape showed that Summers re-entered the office several times and dismissed Ogborn’s pleas for help, a statement which Summers denies.

[/quote]

Now when I first read this, I honestly thought it was a prank. I had to go and verify the sources. It’s a true enough story. What is more disturbing than this is that it’s not only true, many more cases happened similar to this or just like this in America over the last 10 years.

I was honestly left dumbfounded to realise that on the basis of a phone call from some strange guy pretending to be officer Dave, people had performed strip searched, and sexually assaulted young females, but it’s all true.

I think this honestly like nothing else makes me realise how stupid people are a and b how willing they are to give over their wills, their reasoning, their responsibility to any perceived authority figure. Not just the perpetrators, but the victims as well. Not to blame the victims, but you really have to read these stories to believe them.

You can go to wikipedia to read the other cases. It’s bad enough that people stripped down others on behalf of some stranger over a phone, and that people stood their and left themselves be stripped on behalf of some stranger over the phone, but like I said, a few of these cases actually lead to sexual assault, because some guy over the phone, a perceived authority figure said to.

Remember this guy was not really holding a gun to their head. He was not anyplace where he could see them, or they could see him. But the simple fact that he said he was a cop was enough for them to dehumanise others, on multiple occasion, over a number of years.

This really brought the current predicament of Gang Stalking into focus for me. Those people did all that to virtual strangers, cause some virtual stranger pretending to be a cop, over the phone, without any verification told them to.

After reading some of the stories, I believe these people would have gone much further had he told them to, and perpetrated much more disturbing actions.

We are being stalked and harassed, because some authority figure in the system has set their downline on our tail. Unlike the people in the other situations, the people stalking us know that they too can be stalked, or lose their jobs, and they are being watched by others. Also like some of these sick individuals, they are getting a power trip off of this.

If people will do such evil actions with an unidentified stranger over the phone telling them to do it, what are they willing to do with a real live entity telling them to do it. Add in the fact that some of these can be targeted for refusing to go along with this, and that we have some really sick people in society, it really put this into perspective for me.
Three quick take aways from this video.

[quote]The caller wasn’t always successful; phone records show he sometimes called as many as 10 stores before finding one where managers would take his bait. [/quote]

Not everyone is this stupid, but enough are. Why were these managers capable of independent thought, where the others were not?

Evil will get away with what it can.

[quote]Nix left, drove a few blocks to his home and immediately called his best friend, Grigsby, who recalls Nix saying, “I have done something terribly bad.” [/quote]

Mr church going father of two who sodomised the girl, knew what he was going was wrong, even if it was a cop telling him to do it, or that’s what he believed, he knew it was wrong, but he still did it.

The only good thing about this is that he is serving 5 years in an American prison. Originally his victim had agreed to let him only do parole time, if he admitted he did something wrong.

Refusing to go along with evil

[quote]Refusing to play

`Something is not right,’ 9th-grade dropout decides

It was Simms, the Mount Washington store’s maintenance man and a ninth-grade dropout, who refused to play the caller’s game.

He had stopped by the restaurant for dessert and coffee when Summers pulled him into the office and handed him the phone. The caller told Simms to have Ogborn drop the apron and to describe her. Simms refused.[/quote]

Unlike the one above, there will always be those who will refuse to go along with evil.

Now this was suppose to be one long post, but I will have to break it up into two postings.

I now realise that with people so easily bent, so mailable to evil and corruption, that we really have some times ahead of us.

We are being targeted by the Government, these people have been given free reign to do what they will, and it does not take much to bring out the psychopathic or sociopathic in people when they think that you are someone bad or who has done something wrong. When they see you as less than, or believe that they have a license to ill.

In the case above, the guy on the phone pretending to be officer Dave told them, that this innocent 18 year old girl had stolen a purse. For this they were willing to strip search her, rob her of her dignity, degrade her, and sexually assault her. This happened over a period of three hours, but other incidents happened over a much shorter time period.

The guy on the phone knew what would and would not work, and carried on as if almost from a script, just like the evil forces that seek to destroy us. They know what has worked in the past in East Germany, Russia, Cointelpro, etc. These people are old hands at this, and they also know that it does not take long to turn neighbour against neighbour, family against family, friends against friends, especially when there is the added incentive of becoming a target as well, or other punishments for not participating. For many even without threats, intimidation and threats to their lives are perfectly willing to turn and commit evil on others with very little provocation or prompting.

We for our part have to keep our wits about us, and not give into a victim mentally. We have to continue to find ways out, work arounds, and we have to continue to fight for each moment of our dignity. Don’t give your will’s over to this, rage against the dying of the light.

Many ask why the young woman in this situation did not just walk out of the office, why she even stripped down in the first place? I know she has said that she was always taught to obey authority, but who’s authority and where do you draw the line?

What I do know is if you let that line get crossed, that foot in the door, it’s easier and easier for these people to try to victimize you further. You have to really haul ass to get yourself out of the pit that they would so happily see you in.

I do know that once this line got crossed, she stopped asking questions, and didn’t feel she could fight back or just walk out of the office. I think this can be true in real life as well.

I know most of use would like to believe that if in the situation, we would never be the victim, or the victimizer, however until in the situation we don’t always know how we will respond. What we can do however is mentally prepare ourselves as best we can and continually pray for the best.

I think this story really gave a more realistic look at what we are truly dealing with in much of society. It’s a sad reality and it put a lot of things into perspective for me in regards to being a Targeted Individual and the people and types of conformity and control that we are up against.

California Court Rules Homeschooling Illegal.

To me this is one of the most significant things that has happened in a long time. In many ways this is a battle for the future. It’s a battle for the very minds of your children. Soon the state will think it’s their right and theirs alone, to tell your children what to think, feel, believe, and how to act.
I find this more disturbing than many things I have encountered in a really long time. It’s just one State, but thus it begins. If they control the minds of the children, then the future will be indoctrinated and branded with what they want everyone to believe.
http://www.lifesitenews.com/ldn/2008/mar/08030503.html

[quote]Wednesday March 5, 2008 See today’s LifeSiteNews stories

California Court Rules Homeschooling Illegal

By Hilary White

LOS ANGELES, March 5, 2008 (LifeSiteNews.com) – Thousands of homeschoolers in California are left in legal limbo by an appeals court ruling that homeschooling is not a legal option in the state and that a family who has homeschooled all their children for years must enrol their two youngest in state or private schools. Justice H. Walter Croskey in a written opinion said, “California courts have held that under provisions in the Education Code, parents do not have a constitutional right to homeschool their children.”

The sweeping February 29th ruling says that California law requires “persons between the ages of six and eighteen” to be in “public full-time day school,” or a “private full-time day school” or “instructed by a tutor who holds a valid state teaching credential for the grade being taught”.

The two youngest of Phillip and Mary Long’s eight children must be enrolled in a state approved school. Phillip Long told WorldNetDaily, “We just don’t want them teaching our children. They teach things that are totally contrary to what we believe. They put questions in our children’s minds we don’t feel they’re ready for.”[/quote]

I think this is a good article because a few weeks ago they were trying to put parents in jail in Germany for homeschooling.

http://www.hslda.org/hs/international/Germany/200709200.asp

At the time this seemed significant to me because if we are going to have a one world government, then we need to have a unified system where all the minds of the children can be indoctrinated at once. This means that eventually homeschooling will be banned everywhere and only the state will be able to tell your children, what to think, feel, believe, and act. Their loyalty will be to the state, and they will have one unified mind, no matter where they live.

When the case happened and the judges ruling came down I knew there would be repercussions. I did not expect this to start happening this soon in America, but this just leads me to believe that the country is further down that slippery slope than I am willing to believe.

From what I have read on other forums, parents can homeschool under some conditions without a license, so it will be interesting in the coming weeks and months to see what happens next.

It’s funny how things can change in an instant, sometimes when you don’t expect it. Let’s hope at some future point, things start to turn and change for the better.

Eye Opening

I have to do a year and a half in the life of a Targeted Individual (TI) post soon, but before I do that, I just had a really eye opening conversation yesterday on one of these forums. It seems at least one person was confused with the concept of hand signals vs people being sensitised. It seems this person might have been under the impression that the hand signals were themselves being used to sensitize people. I am not sure how this person came up with this, since I have blogged extensively about both. This person also seemed to be under the impression that the East German Stasi signals that were used 50 years ago, are one and the same that are being used now. The conversation was really eye opening, and if one person is confused others might be confused. Therefore this post will try to clarify the difference.
The Stasi in East Germany used a one handed sign language to communicate. There signals have been documented and referenced to by Anna Funder and others in their research on East Germany and the Stasi. In her book and online Articles. Anna Funder gave us a very small sample of Stasi Signals that were being used in East Germany. See them listed below.
They will also communicate with each other on the street by using Statsi like signals. Below are some examples of Stasi signals. SIGNALS FOR OBSERVATION

1. Watch out! Subject is coming – touch nose with hand or handkerchief
2. Subject is moving on, going further, or overtaking – stroke hair with hand, or raise hat briefly
3. Subject standing still – lay one hand against back, or on stomach
4. Observing Agent wishes to terminate observation because cover threatened – bend and retie shoelaces
5. Subject returning – both hands against back, or on stomach
6. Observing Agent wishes to speak with Team Leader or other Observing Agents – take out briefcase or equivalent and examine contents.
There were used only as a point of reference and it was not to indicate that the exact same ones were being used in the current situation, just hand signals that were very similar, which I have referenced to the ones that I have seen before in other postings. Again these are ruff translations and you have to judge what you are seeing and experiencing for yourself.

Double Blink 
Touching the nose, (Or also touching with both thumb and pointer finger)
Using the nose and finger for directional signals
Touching the eyes left to right, or covering the eyes with one hand over both eyes
Brushing the hair back three times
Stroking the hair at the (nape) back of the neck three times, or
Using water or any liquid to open communication, or pretending to yawn, cover the mouth
David Lawson who I hardly ever reference to for reasons I have stated before. In his book (possibly disinfo) also referenced that these Gang Stalkers use one handed sign language that look like Base ball signals. If anyone has seen a baseball game then you have seen empires and pitchers use these signals to represent different things. If you have never seen a baseball game, you won’t have any idea what this means, and therefore the reference might not be the most effective one.

I have also explained that he one handed signals that I have seen being used might also be similar to ones that are used by under cover police officers. They use a one handed sign language called talking hands. There are even courses that are being taught for people who want to assist the police, who want to learn these signals. I have also posted about this before.

Course Date: January 29, 2007 (8 hours)
Location: TBA
Sponsored by: The Gadsden Police Department & Multijurisdictional Counterdrug Task Force Training
Tuition: FREE   FREE  FREE
 
Description: This course will provide students with the ability to communicate with each other non verbally using one-handed signals in police environments and without the suspects hearing anything. This training, based upon the same signs used by the hearing impaired public, will cover basic nonverbal communication techniques using single-hand sign language for use in police environments or situations where verbal communication is not desirable.  As part of the course, students will also demonstrate the use of these hand signals through practical exercises, scenarios, and final assessment.
 
http://gangstalkingworld.com/Forum/YaBB.pl?num=1168628196
 
Course Objectives:
 
Understand the benefits of using officer hand signals 
Utilize a wide variety of officer hand signals including descriptions and colors 
Demonstrate the ability to use various hand signals effectively in a given situation 
 
Overview of Topics:
 
Benefit of Patrol Officer Hand Signal 
The Cop Talk Signs 
The Cop Talk Description Signs 
The Cop Talk Colors 
Practical Application and Exercises 
Hand Signal Use Assessment  
Now the other thing this person seemed confused about. He thought the one handed sign language was being used to sensitise people. This is not the case. The one handed sign language is being used to communication amongst the Civilian Spies. It’s not, I don’t think, being used to sensitise anyone. Things that are being used to sensitise people have been listed before on this website. Here is a list of some popular ones.

Getting a Targeted Individual sensitized to an everyday stimuli. The targeted individual over a period of months, or even years is negatively sensitised to an everyday stimuli, which is then used to harass them. It’s used out in public to let them know they are constantly being harassed and monitored. Some examples of everyday stimulus that might be used include: sounds, colors, patterns, actions. Eg. Red, white, yellow, strips, pens clicking, key jangling, loud coughing, loud whistling, loud smacking of clapping of hands together, cell phones, laptops, etc.

Disrupting the targets life, sleep with loud power tools, drilling, construction, stereos, doors slamming, etc. Talking in public about private things in the targets life. Mimicking actions of the target. Basically letting the target know that they are in the targets life. Daily interferences, nothing that would be too overt to the untrained eye, but psychologically degrading and damaging to the target over time.
I just found some videos on youtube and in one of the videos Norma Desmond (not her real name) talks about the Gang Stalkers and the signals they were using, in the first video. She also does a really good job of explaining why Gang Stalking is so hard to recognise. After seeing the video I hope it will help make things clearer for a lot of people. I think Norma does a really good job, the videos are really eye opening and I hope they will serve to help other targets understand what we are all up against in our efforts to bring awareness about Gang Stalking. I have not had a chance to watch all the videos myself.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=h5rJrtE6Zjk
http://youtube.com/watch?v=vF9A8UM5vuk
http://youtube.com/watch?v=7BQkYIyua0Q
http://youtube.com/watch?v=F-F8bAeRlIk
http://youtube.com/watch?v=k_SI_UpVF1U

Society of secrecy.

This is the post that will sound out there, no matter how I write it, and no matter what I do, so I will just go for.

This is in relationship to Mark M. Rich and the fact that he thinks this is a bit more than a subset of society. I just think this is how the society is period, and some of us just don’t realise this, but many others do, and are just not saying anything.

Not only is there a plethora of movies, books, soaps, that try to describe bits of this from time to time, or other times in history, but this is also based on my own personal experience.

When I first discovered the snitching and the one handed sign language, I ofcourse wanted to make sure that I was on the right track, so I did the only thing that I could do. When you have a hypothesis you have to go out and prove it, and get verifiable results that can be repeated, or something like that.

If this is what I was seeing, then I should be able to get confirmation of it. This is the part that surprised me, because to get confirmation for a time I had to interact with the Civilian Spies/Snitches.

This was also when I realised that not all of them were evil, many of them were just average citizens thinking they were doing a good job for the society. Many were actually proud. I think I might have mentioned this in my postings or on the forums. Before this, I ofcourse just thought that they were evil.

I mean from a Targeted Individual (TI) perspective, they are driving people to suicide, or acts of violence, pushing them towards homelessness, mobbing people out of work, setting them up for being jailed or institutionalised, I mean these are horrific acts to be perpetrating against your fellow man, but these people they don’t care, they also don’t necessarily see it that way. That’s what the hands on research would show me.

Back to Mark’s point and why I think that this is just how society is.

[b]The Snitches[/b]

When this started I would go on the train, that’s where I observed some things, and got much confirmation. Remember this is me on the train for the last year and a half. I would walk through train cars to see if the snitching thing was happening in more than one train car, I wanted to make sure that the snitches were not just concentrated where I was. Not the case, I could go from one car almost to the end, and it would be the same thing. Average citizens, all ages, races, genders, that were part of the Civilian Spying/Snitching force.

I also during this time period interacted with some, to try to confirm either verbally or none verbally the things that I was observing, and did get the confirmations that I was seeking. Oh the concentrations that I was seeing on the trains, I have listed as 90%, but what I would really be observing is almost 100% concentrations.

At the various places that I have worked over the last year and a half. Work use to be normal and steady before this, now it’s transitional, and variety based. The system can keep you unemployed, or push you into specific jobs that it wants you to be pushed into. It can make sure you are on contact vs fully employed, or other things. Just let’s say that when people say that the system is keeping them out of a job, or they are blacklisted, it’s not a joke. It’s hard to imagine how it can happen, in a democratic society, but that is just the joke, about this so called democratic society.

Anyways. Every job that I have had has had snitches. I can tell you at 2 out of 4 locations that every co-worker on my level was snitching. The 4th location I was not there long enough to make an accurate observation, what I did see was right up there however. Two of the jobs were for smaller companies, but again the training classes were 100% filled with co-workers who were Civilian Spies/Snitches.

I have spoken to people who have advised that it’s the government, others who think this is just another McCarthyism, others who think that the snitching is localised to where they work, they don’t get to see what I saw and experienced as a target. Eg. That this is global and not just localised, another assured me it’s normal and this happens in others countries, as well. (Yeah, good to know.)

At one job where I worked, we had international students, from various places around the globe, and again they were snitches. I can only assume that this is what is happening in their countries as well, or they learnt the snitching to be part of this exchange program.

[b]Vibrating/Pulsating Floors[/b]

Other experiences. With the vibrating floors, it almost feels like a mini power generator is making the floors pulsate/vibrate. I know that sounds weird, at work right, all jobs? If I was not experiencing it, I would think it was just out there. However I like to confirm what I am experiencing, so I got feedback from others.

At one job where this happened. Not only would the floors vibrate, but when this would happen, we had this glass that was sort of like frosted glass, but it would shake, and you could visually see it. I also would get co-workers to confirm what was happening with the vibrations or ask questions as to what was making it happen. There were people that were very aware of what was going on, and well… (I will leave it at that.)

The other job, I was not there long enough to make too many observations. The shaking thing was happening, but I think based on what was happening it was affecting the persons beside me just as much. We would have moments, where we would have to stand up at the exact same times, (due to the intensity of the shaking floors) and once I made eye contact with the person beside when this happened and the person was like, “I just don’t want to know.” I left it at that, but it was one of those things.

Another job this happened in the training class, and I thought it was just me at first, but it’s not. The whole training class was experiencing this. That was and is the part that I just can’t wrap my mind around. As a target you are like, it’s just me, no one else knows what’s going on, that’s why we must expose this, but that’s wrong. Some people do know what is going on, and when I say some people, I believe a large majority of some people.

People know some of the stuff that is going on. Most times they don’t think that I do. (I don’t feel that I can go into more details here.) However with the vibrating floors, they were falling asleep and not loving the heat, it’s funny for me it was a break from my apartment which on any given day had to be 10 times worst than what was happening there.

Another time when this was happening at said job, one of the co-workers showed me that when it happens, you just stand up, like this. (That’s the part where you can’t actually pretend that they don’t know what’s happening, but you also can’t ask any questions, or rather, I just choose not to.) There was more, but I don’t want to go into too much of this.

The other job, I really don’t remember much outside of the snitching. I was there way too briefly to observe much outside of that.

[b]Other Targets[/b]

Other things. At one job, I mentioned that there was another person who was also a target. I think I have blogged about some aspects of that before, if not then I will leave out the details in this post. However at that same job there was a third person there, and I was starting to suspect that stuff was ongoing with this person, but this person was really scared a lot of the time, however there was a specific instance, that lead me to this belief.

Along the way as a target, I have told you about some of my conversations with the police officers, some helpful some not.

Also as far as finding other targets, I mentioned the person at the one job, also the woman who was apartment hunting when I was, and she was experiencing the same stuff.

People that I worked with, one person had to sell their business and move into a below ground apartment. I believe that had to do with the electromagnetic harassment. Also this person would refer to the weird end of the world stuff that was happening.

People that I worked with that I know were forced to take part in what was going on, one person looked scared out of his mind as I saw him participating, very much against his will.

People that I am associated with, one person was going through similar stuff, and was complaining about it, years before I even realised it was ongoing in my life.
(Yes I did think this person was a little bit off at the time, I mean this person was saying that people were coming into the house and changing stuff around. It sounded crazy and at the time, I just thought the person maybe was mistaken, but I did leave an open mind. Now I see that this happens to more people than I realise. This person is also now getting electronically harassed.)

There are other things, but you get to the stage where you are like, it’s not just me. This has been the hardest part to wrap my mind around. It’s not just me. Even when I first came online and found out about Gang Stalking, I was like wow this happens to other people?
What I am seeing and experiencing offline, is a much more common phenomenon, much more widespread, and much more awareness. The Civilian Spies know they are Civilian Spies, some realise exactly what’s going on, some don’t know, or don’t seem to realise how widespread this is. There seems to be quite a few people being kept in line this way, controlled this way, conformed this way.

If you are not aware of it, it will sound crazy to you, it would have sounded crazy to me, but you have to experience it to believe it.

Rumours, and the reason that they seem to like the system. They are all connected. That means that if you are a target and person A says something about you, that information even if and when it’s false can go out throughout the whole Civilian Spy/Snitch system. You might never hear back what is being said, but everyone else does and the zombies will act on that information, true or not true. Remember the following articles.

http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/08/14/news/korea.php

(Did anyone ever stop to wonder how information about this person in a few short weeks made it out to his school, work, community so much so that he had to quit his school, job, and his family had to move?)

http://online.wsj.com/public/article/SB116855242776974364-OeszoAs0Sa3YsO80IOEwzj7Vfg8_20080112.html?mod=blogs

[quote][b]The digital age allows critics to quickly find a fair amount of information about their targets.[/b] One day last November, at about 11:30 a.m., a blog focused on making New York streets more bike-friendly posted the license plate number of an SUV driver who allegedly accelerated from a dead stop to hit a bicycle blocking his way.

At 1:16 p.m., someone posted the registration information for the license plate, including the SUV owner’s name and address. (The editor of the blog thinks the poster got the information from someone who had access to a license-plate look-up service, available to lawyers, private investigators and police.) At 1:31 p.m., another person added the owner’s occupation, his business’s name and his title. Ten minutes later, a user posted a link to an aerial photo of the owner’s house. Within another hour, the posting also included the accused’s picture and email address.

The SUV’s owner, Ian Goldman, the chief executive of Celerant Technology Corp. in the New York City borough of Staten Island, declined to comment for this article. According to an email exchange posted on the blog, Mr. Goldman said that he had lent the vehicle in question to a relative with “an urgent medical situation” and that he was not aware of any incident. The alleged victim has decided to drop the matter since the damage to the bicycle, which he was standing next to at the time, was under $20. Last month, Aaron Naparstek, editor of the blog, says he removed Mr. Goldman’s home and email addresses from the site after receiving a “lawyerly cease and desist” email asking that the whole posting be deleted.
[/quote]

Again these people are organised, the above two examples are just a few of many. Other examples of how this information network works and how fast it travels. Between cellphone, text messaging and what have you, these people are and can be more aware of your life than you are.

In my own situation I have seen rumours start in the workplace, and I can tell you that people along the way, know your business, true or not true. The other thing is, if you are a target and not a part of this snitch network, you often times are out of the loop and will not hear stuff back, or at all. You might never have a clue about what is being said or put out there about you, and thus have no way to defend yourself. The other thing that I find humorous somewhat, is that the Snitches then expect you to know what is being said about you, and feel justified in their actions that they take.

Eg. My most recent job, my P.A.M. I realised was starting one rumour after another, and what I did figure out, I tried to correct, but to no avail. People on the Snitch network of social friends, believe and trust other snitches. Why should they not, they are all the same thing. So really after figuring out that there was something afoot, and trying to get it corrected, I just gave up, because at the end of the day, people will believe what they want to believe. It’s a wasteful process. Doesn’t mean you can’t try, but just realise what you are dealing with.

So you have at the end of the day, a society that is built on secrecy, people will cover things up, and they will keep their mouths shut for years, open secrets that are not really secrets. When they come out, you are almost amazed that they stayed covered up for so long but they did. The nice thing is sometimes these things do come out, but from what I have seen it often does not change things and these people just learn to cover their tracks better.

Eg. Children being abused by Priests, have you truly ever wondered how that was just not talked about, and yet so many people knew and there were so many victims, yet it remained a secret for how many decades?

Child sexual abuse, happens to so many apparently, but this was also something that was not discussed or talked about.

You would think this new openness would change all this stuff right? All that has happened with the church thing is that new cases now have to go through the Church before they can be prosecuted, now you can’t get at them locally, it has to go through the Vatican first. Now it’s easier to get away with molesting young kids. Also the church routinely let’s Priest hold up at or around the Vatican in Rome, for sanctuary.

Molesters now use online services to group molest children, and in the digital age, parents are not smarter or more careful with their children. The predators get smarter and society seems to think that because this stuff is out in the open, they no longer have to have their guards up. Don’t anyone wonder how they can have hundreds of thousands of kids in pictures, in poses, doing stuff, where are the parents? Where is the guard that society is now suppose to be on?

Kids are still molested in their homes, and in many cases the conspiracy of silence still continues. Cause that’s what society is good at.

Civilian Spies, have been around for over a hundred years, snitches go back far into history. Even as this gets exposed, and you realise like I have on some level that it’s not just me. It won’t change this. I mean for a time it will, but only long enough to teach these people how to better cover their darkness.

Control, conformity, corruption can happen out in public and that is the best place for it. We have a society of secrecy happening, if you don’t know, you likely will not believe, I know I could not have a year and a half ago, I would have argued it into the ground. Even now that I know or realise on some level, it’s hard to deal with. There is not a day that I don’t shake my head, and wonder how they can go along with it. I know the answer in many ways, fear, power, conformity, fitting in, and ofcourse the secrecy of it all. That silence that let’s you be a part of something great, and the penalty for revealing what you know. Be it being socially annexed, or also Gang Stalked and Electronically Harassed. It’s just another society where you know the rules, spoken or unspoken. First rule of stalk club, you don’t talk about stalk club, second rule of stalk club, you don’t talk about stalk club.

Anyways that’s the post.

Mark is right when he says it’s not a subset of society, but I don’t know if he realises that this seems to be just how society is. The ones that are not in the know, really don’t know. I didn’t. The ones that do know, know how to keep their mouths shut, and they don’t step out of line.

You have smaller group examples of this, the military and hazing, churches and cults stalking people who leave, other subsets of society where secrecy is a must, but then there is society, where it’s a society of secrecy. Even if and when this get’s exposed and talked about, the light will not shine for very long, these people can cover their darkness so well, because they put it out there almost right into the open. That’s the weird part that I understand on one level, but still can’t come to terms with on another.

What is making us NOT fight back?

I came across this most excellent post, and after following all the requirments below, felt embolded to reprint it. I think it’s worth a blog post.
Attribution.

Author: Dock6
Affiliation: AboveTopSecret.com
Title: What is making us NOT fight back?
Link: http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread202159/pg1#pid2123735
posted on 5-4-2006 @ 09:33 AM  
 

Excellent post ! I think many people are asking themselves the same questions as those you’ve posed.

You’re right: sixty years ago this situation could never have evolved. A hundred a sixty years ago, no politician or group of politicians would have dared attempt the repressive control of populations as is now occurring.

But maybe I’m wrong. Pearl Harbour for example — the radar technicians were stood down, apparently, in order the Japanese could launch their fatal attacks. Did those radar technicians come forward? Not even ONE of them? I don’t think we can accept that not one of them, or even six of them, did not examine their conscience and decide they must reveal what they knew.

So how come we only learned about the betrayal that was Pearl Harbour, a few years ago? How come for all those decades, we believed that the Japanese had somehow achieved the impossible by bombing Pearl Harbour? How come we didn’t ask ourselves: ‘ Hey ! How the hell did those Japs get so CLOSE to Pearl without being detected???? What the hell were the radar guys doing …. sleeping? ‘

But we didn’t ask, did we? And no one told us. Instead, we watched all the movies and tv shows and books …. and we bought their story: we suspended our critical faculties and simply accepted what we were told and shown.

How come the media of the day didn’t ask: ‘ Hey! How the hell did it happen? What were the radar guys doing?’. And it’s interesting, when you think of it, that not ONE of those radar guys’ stories made it into the mainstream media of the day? How come the betrayal of Pearl Harbour was not exposed, way back then?

So, the media has been manipulating us a long time, without our even realising it, back then.

Another factor is the ‘one in twenty’ theory. Apparently, administrators of jails and POW camps, etc., *find* the one in twenty, and isolate them. The one in twenty is the one who initiates action; who motivates the remaining 19; who acts as natural leader. The one in twenty is smarter, more capable, more independently minded than the other 19. The other 19 can be restrained with minimum effort; they are sheep-like, relatively obdedient; are ‘followers’. Get rid of the one in twenty, and your job of controlling the other 19 is easy. Perhaps repressive regimes are actively seeking the ‘ones in twenty’ within our midst. They might find them at protest rallies; in internet forums; etc. They are the first to be picked off. Perhaps they’ve *already* been picked off, which might account for all us sheepies, just sitting here in confusion and dismay, waiting for our ‘leaders’ to come and show us what to do to save ourselves ?

Then there’s testosterone. It’s what makes men fiesty; willing to take on aggressors and repressors. Knock out the testosterone and men become malleable: peaceable; hesitant; unsure; docile. It’s been shown that men can be (and are being?) turned into a form of psuedo-female, via chemicals contained in foods, drinks, food and drink wrappings and containers, etc.

Another means of putting men out of balance and unsure of their role and capabilities, is to kick their confidence around on daily basis. We’ve been advised (by Makow amongst others) that the Women’s Lib movement was a pivotal phase in the Zionist destruction of western societies. Women AND men were the dupes. Men were told they had to change, had to accept a less dominant role at home, work, socially, etc. So men grew used to repressing their inherent maleness for fear of giving unintended offence, or of inviting criticism, of being considered ‘unacceptable’ generally. This created confusion in men; lack of confidence and feelings of shame about who and what they were.

Another tool in the Zionist agenda was to destroy the family unit. Men traditionally were heads of families; were the breadwinners. They gained their sense of identity from this. By promoting Women’s Lib and encouraging women to leave the home for work, men no longer felt like the head of anything. Yet every ship needs a captain, and there can only be ONE captain. A family is a ship; one leak and it’s disaster.

The family unit was further undermined through drugs, pornography, easily-obtained divorce, credit, consumerism and government dictates that forced parents to surrender their children to dumbed-down education systems that encouraged children to challenge their parents at the same time it forbade parents to discipline their children effectively. Governments imposed their versions of ‘sex education’ upon children and insist that children recognise same-gender sexuality and marriage, etc. Parents have had to sit back and watch their children being exposed to inordinate emphasis on sexuality: at school, in the media, etc. Parents are ‘punished’ if they object to what they clearly feel is an unhealthy agenda aimed at their children, by the government for which they pay.

People have been told they ‘must not’ object to government dictates; ‘must not’ voice their opinions about issues of race, immigration, education, government decisions, corruption, and a dozen other issues.

People are afraid to open their mouths. They feel their opinions are ‘wrong’ or punishable. The media reports the punitive actions of governments against those in society who speak out. The media is engaged in a campaign of terror, on behalf of governments. People see black-outfitted monsters, seemingly seven feet tall, their faces hidden behind black visors, their shoulders padded to immense proportions, wearing six inch soles, weilding a variety of terrifying weapons against old age pensions staging a peaceful protest. People are terrified. What if *they* were beaten by these government sanctioned goons, simply for being in the wrong place at the wrong time? What would happen to their family if they were incarcerated without charge or evidence?

So, for quite some time now, people have been manipulated by governments who push and pull, push and pull. The message people are being given is brutality simple: keep your mouths shut and do as your told and you might survive what we have in store for you. What we may or may not have in store for you is a secret. However, if you DO dare to open your mouth and voice any objection to this govenment, we can promise you that you will suffer a fate worse than death. Now go to work, shut your mouths, see nothing, hear nothing, say nothing , think nothing, pay your taxes, obey us, believe everything we tell you even though we will vary our tune daily …. and you and your family might make it through until next week. You have no opinon, no rights and probably no future. So shut up and enjoy what little you have today.

No, governments and corporations couldn’t have gotten away with this sixty years ago. But sixty years ago, people had just fought the fight of their lives, WW2. They’d survived the ravages of the Great Depression. Then along came the golden years; the 50′s and 60′s and formica and refrigerators and air-conditioning and new cars and homes and light, romantic Doris Day/Rock Hudson comedies and extended leisure time. Golf and tennis and music lessons were no longer just the province of the wealthy. People grew used to a new, more leisurely, more materialistically enriched lifestyle. They grew used to peace, to governments who handled the big-issues, which resulted in ‘more’ of the good stuff for much of the population. Gone for most, were the days of not enough food and money. Everything seemed wonderful and getting better by the day. People forgot ‘hardship’ as their parents had known it. And movies and the new wonders of tv introduced people to ‘escapism’; encouraged them to dream often unrealistic ambitions for themselves and their children.

In other words, people lost much of their ‘edge’. They grew complacent to a degree. They wanted the fun stuff of life and left government deal with the boring issues. People surrendered their independence in return for what seemed like the good life. And then they took the good life for granted.

Problem is, when you hand responsibility for yourself to someone else, or to a group of others, you need to realise that those others are going to do what’s in *their* interests, not yours.

Governments/politicians are NOT the way they’re portrayed in all those movies and tv shows. Sure, they have the nice suits and the grey-flecked hair and good teeth. Their voices are often rich and deep and comforting, but so are a lot of radio announcers’ voices … and a lot of those are maniacs. It’s not HOW they speak, but what they say that matters. But most important of all is what they neglect to say, which is actually what they secretly MEAN.

TV and movies have manipulated us to accept that if a politician LOOKS nice, then he/she is ‘good’. We’ve come to believe that if a politician went to a ‘good’ school; if he is handsome, if he lives in an exclusive neighbourhood, if he socialises with celebrities … then he is someone we should allow to control our lives. Well, Madonna is a celebrity and Tom Cruise has nice teeth and hair … but would you let them determine your children’s fate? Would you allow them to poison your water and food and strip you of employment and your previously nice neighbourhood? Arnold Swartzenegger was dynamic in Terminator and funny as hell in Twins and Kindergarten Cop …… but does that really qualify him to control the lives of millions? Does it?

At the moment, we’re waiting like frightened sheep, hoping the days of Fonzie and Brady Bunch mentality will return. We don’t like these wars and unemployment and fear. We want it all to stop. We want to be able to go back to enjoying that sense of childhood we knew even ten years ago. We want someone to step up and fix things so that we can feel better. And according to various so-called ‘conspiracy theories’, we’re exactly where ‘they’ want us to be, right on schedule. According to the same theories, ‘they’ will soon introduce the anti-Christ … who will look exactly the way we’ve been conditioned to expect our ‘leaders’ to look: tall, tanned, silver tipped hair, nice suit and teeth and a voice like honey, which will reassure us that all we have to do is follow him and we’ll all be able to sit back and relax and enjoy again …….. forever, in hell.

It all comes down, as Bob Dylan said a long time ago, to doing it yourself: ‘ If you want someone to trust … trust yourself ‘ — ‘ If you want someone to love — love yourself’ — ‘ If you want someone to believe — believe yourself’.

There will always be one in twenty. But they’re having a rough time right now, like the female lawyer they’re trying to lock up for 106 years for doing nothing more than exposing corruption in her locality. SHE is one of the ones in twenty. You have a choice: support and defend those Ones in Twenty now, so that they can fix your world up for you. Or sit back on your couch and watch re-runs of Everyone Loves Raymond and let them take those Ones in Twenty away, leaving you and yours helpless and doomed. But people are going to have to make a decision and live with it, because this crap isn’t going to go away or get better without a hell of a lot of work and risk.

One of the best bits of advice available at this time, is to do as the ancient Scots did, when they were poised at the edge of a life and death battle. They recited their genealogy, then called to God, saying: ‘God — give me the courage of my ancestors ! ‘ Doing the same might just be what puts us on the right path and gives us the courage to continue.

Catch up

Ever notice how none of these so called conspiracy debunkers ever tell the world about the fact that we are one big snitching society? I mean many of them will tell us we are controlled, slaves etc, but none of them come right out and tell you this stuff. Makes you wonder? Well it makes me wonder.

Anyways there is still lots of really good information out there, but like I have said previously, I would not really vouch for any of these people, cause it’s hard to know who you can really trust. If anyone.

So quick catch up. The world is on it’s way, if it’s not already there to becoming one big snitching controlled society. Families and friends, coworkers, landlords, strangers are actively spying, snitching, and lying on their fellow citizens. Yeah it’s happening.

If you are like I was a year ago, then you also have probably been conditioned from birth to believe that we live in this free none controlled society, when in reality our society is this matrix controlled society. We really do not have the freedom that we think we do. We are slaves, (it doesn’t feel like it, because we are totally controlled to think that we are free, and until we learn differently, it’s hard to believe anything else.) We get up go to work, church, school, clubs, amusement parks, read our magazines, hear about controlled countries, and assume that we are free. The opposite is true.

Normally when you think of slaves, you think of whips, chains, and cruelty. Well we are slaves, but not exactly in that way. We are psychological slaves, we are controlled and most of us don’t even realise it. We are controlled without physical bonds, and without bars on windows. We are in a psychological prison, and you think, but I am smart, if I was in a prison, I would know it. Yeah same thing I would have said a year ago. I can’t make you believe it anymore than someone could have made me believe this a year ago. You have to experience it for yourself. The truth of this will come emotionally, not mentally.

Most of society is either aware, or has some idea about what is going on. Most people just go along with it. It’s true. I am not saying they want to, some do, but most just go along with it.

Here are some good videos that might help you with playing catch up. The David Icke videos you will have to go looking for yourself, cause I don’t want to get anyone else’s accounts closed down. :eyeroll:
The clips from the movie They Live, the movie with Roddie Piper were removed. Also the matrix clip talking about the fact that we are slaves, and the world is this fake thing that has been pulled over our eyes to blind us from the truth.
The matrix clip. I can post the script for. The They Live clip, you really have to see to understand.

The video links are pretty cool, the ones I can link to. The others, you will have to go looking for. David Icke has a lot of interesting things to say. I am not saying I am down with his whole reptilian theory, although stranger things have happened, like this creepy controlled society, but for the time being I would just say, look past that keep an open mind, and pay attention to most of the other stuff he talks about, it’s really good stuff. I differ in my views with him, on some very specific stuff, but a lot of what he says is just spot on.

The other clips are from this guy called Marsboy683. He is suppose to be a targeted individual. Either way, the clips are interesting.

The other clips try to explain what the matrix is. I vouch for none of this stuff, and ask you to do your own research. Don’t follow leaders, strive to be leaders in your own right. If more people had done this, then when some of the past leaders disappeared, ready and able people would have been there to step up into place.

Matrix script, since the scene was removed from youtube, shortly after the blog posting linking to it, here is the script.

Morpheus : The Matrix is everywhere. It’s all around us, even in this
very room. You can see it when you look out your window or
when you turn on your television. You can feel it when you
go to work, when you go to work, when you pay your taxes.
The Matrix is the world that has been pulled over your eyes,
to blind you from the truth.

Neo : What truth?

Morpheus : That you are a slave, Neo. Like everyone else, you were born
into bondage, born into a prison that you cannot smell or
taste or touch. A prison…for your mind….Unfortunatly,
no one can be…_told_ what the Matrix is…you have to see
it for yourself.

They live script.

First scene that I think is good. I am not saying it’s completely accurate, just relevant enough to try to begin to grasp some stuff.

[quote]

Our impulses are being redirected,

We live in an artificially-induced
state of consciousness,

Goddamn hacker. That’s the second
time tonight that asshole has cut in.

The movement began eight months ago
by a group of scientists,

They accidentally discovered
these signals being sent,,,

That thing’s giving me a headache.

It must have taken him months
to figure out how to do this.

The under-class is growing,
Human rights are non-existent,

In their repressive society, we
are their unwitting accomplices,

Their intention to rule rests with
the annihilation of consciousness,

We have been lulledinto a trance,
They have made us indifferent,

We are focused
only on our own gain ,,,

They are safe
as long as they are not discovered,

That is their method of survival,
Keep us asleep, Keep us selfiish,

- Keep us sedated,

[/quote]

[quote]The sleeping middle-class
is suddenly becoming poor,

We are their cattle,
We are being bred for slavery,

- Not again.
- We cannot break their signal,

The signal must be shut off
at the source,

- I have a headache.
- Me too, honey.

- What was that all about?
- That idiot’s licking his nuts again.

THEY LIVE WE SLEEP
[/quote]

The following scene is one of the best in the movie. He puts on the glasses and the magazine covers, billboard’s all show what they are really saying. The pages dissolve into words such as obey, no independent thought, marry and reproduce, the dollar bill says, this is your god. It’s a great scene and you really have to see it to understand. It’s relevant, because underlying, our world does condition us in very similar ways, and we are equally unaware.

[quote]The warm collection revels
in freedom ofexpression,

OBEY

OBEY

MARRY AND REPRODUCE

NO INDEPENDENT THOUGHT

CONSUME

BUY

OBEY

DO NOT QUESTION AUTHORITY

What’s your problem?

What’s your problem?

How are you today, sir?

Thank you, sir.

Here you are, sir. Thank you.

Are you going to pay for that?

THIS IS YOUR GOD

I don’t want no hassle.
Pay for it or put it back.

Sleep,

Sleep,

Sleep,
[/quote]

Marsboy683

http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=marsboy683

I can’t find any fake reasons for them to shut down his channel, so he should be ok. Keeping the fingers crossed. There are about 78 videos, I have not seen them all, but the ones I have are really good. Worth while stuff to watch.

The David Icke stuff, is mostly stuff about him talking about the real nature of physical reality, and also him giving an analogy of how we enslave each other. Eg. One slave tries to escape and the rest all run to block the door to stop the slave from escaping. It’s interesting because we saw some of this in the mil gram prison experiment. Within days they had these middle class white males all freaking out, fake cops trying to get some to snitch and spy on each other, and the fake cops trying to get them to simulate sexual acts on each other, when they thought no one was looking, and that was an experiment, where people knew it was an experiment. Even the person conducting the experiment got caught up, and that was in less than one week. However it gives wonderful insight into how a society can become like this in such a short time period.

http://www.prisonexp.org/

[quote]thoroughly confusing all the prisoners. Some of the prisoners who were the ringleaders now thought that the prisoners from the privileged cell must be informers, and suddenly, the prisoners became distrustful of each other. Our ex-convict consultants later informed us that a similar tactic is used by real guards in real prisons to break prisoner alliances. For example, racism is used to pit Blacks, Chicanos, and Anglos against each other. In fact, in a real prison the greatest threat to any prisoner’s life comes from fellow prisoners. By dividing and conquering in this way, guards promote aggression among inmates, thereby deflecting it from themselves.[/quote]

See this is classic. Make people distrust each other, then they can’t form together to get at the real problem and trust each other enough to form a real rebellion against the true oppressors, cause they are too busy mistrusting, and fighting against each others. Society does this with sexism, racism, religious and political conflicts, when really, we have common goals and should be focusing on the same things.

[quote]The prisoners’ rebellion also played an important role in producing greater solidarity among the guards. Now, suddenly, it was no longer just an experiment, no longer a simple simulation. Instead, the guards saw the prisoners as troublemakers who were out to get them, who might really cause them some harm. In response to this threat, the guards began stepping up their control, surveillance, and aggression.

[/quote]

Much like our insane controlled society gone bad. They too have suddenly felt a need to step up their control, surveillance, and aggression.

[quote]
As soon as I realized that #819 could hear the chanting, I raced back to the room where I had left him, and what I found was a boy sobbing uncontrollably while in the background his fellow prisoners were yelling that he was a bad prisoner. No longer was the chanting disorganized and full of fun, as it had been on the first day. Now it was marked by utter conformity and compliance, as if a single voice was saying, “#819 is bad.”

I suggested we leave, but he refused. Through his tears, he said he could not leave because the others had labeled him a bad prisoner. Even though he was feeling sick, he wanted to go back and prove he was not a bad prisoner.

At that point I said, “Listen, you are not #819. You are [his name], and my name is Dr. Zimbardo. I am a psychologist, not a prison superintendent, and this is not a real prison. This is just an experiment, and those are students, not prisoners, just like you. Let’s go.”

He stopped crying suddenly, looked up at me like a small child awakened from a nightmare, and replied, “Okay, let’s go.” [/quote]

I find this experiment to be fascinating. How free people, even when they know it’s an experiment, can be so completely over taken. Much like how the state breaks the will of the people, the experimenters and fake guards in this experiment were able to break the will of these boys, to the extent that they would turn on each other, to the extent that they would treat one of their own this way. Remember this was an experiment where the players had all agreed to take part. Imagine a society where the majority have not agreed to take part.

[quote]Several remarkable things occurred during these parole hearings. First, when we asked prisoners whether they would forfeit the money they had earned up to that time if we were to parole them, most said yes. Then, when we ended the hearings by telling prisoners to go back to their cells while we considered their requests, every prisoner obeyed, even though they could have obtained the same result by simply quitting the experiment. Why did they obey? Because they felt powerless to resist. Their sense of reality had shifted, and they no longer perceived their imprisonment as an experiment. In the psychological prison we had created, only the correctional staff had the power to grant paroles.[/quote]

I never really understood why in a slave society the slaves did not rebel more or over take their oppressors. I now realise that a) First you have to understand that you are a slave, and accept that. b) You also have to realise that a psychological prison is as or more effective than a real prison. It’s the minds that these people enslave, the physical is just a sham.

[quote]Prisoners coped with their feelings of frustration and powerlessness in a variety of ways. At first, some prisoners rebelled or fought with the guards. Four prisoners reacted by breaking down emotionally as a way to escape the situation. One prisoner developed a psychosomatic rash over his entire body when he learned that his parole request had been turned down. Others tried to cope by being good prisoners, doing everything the guards wanted them to do. One of them was even nicknamed “Sarge,” because he was so military-like in executing all commands.

By the end of the study, the prisoners were disintegrated, both as a group and as individuals. There was no longer any group unity; just a bunch of isolated individuals hanging on, much like prisoners of war or hospitalized mental patients. The guards had won total control of the prison, and they commanded the blind obedience of each prisoner. [/quote]

I think to really understand what is going on with some of our fellew humans in society, you have to really understand the above. I never realised the will of the people could be contained, controlled and broken so easily.

[quote]Prisoner #416 coped by going on a hunger strike to force his release. After several unsuccessful attempts to get #416 to eat, the guards threw him into solitary confinement for three hours, even though their own rules stated that one hour was the limit. Still, #416 refused.

At this point #416 should have been a hero to the other prisoners. But instead, the others saw him as a troublemaker. The head guard then exploited this feeling by giving prisoners a choice. They could have #416 come out of solitary if they were willing to give up their blanket, or they could leave #416 in solitary all night.

What do you think they chose? Most elected to keep their blanket and let their fellow prisoner suffer in solitary all night. (We intervened later and returned #416 to his cell.) [/quote]

This reminds me again of what I was noticing and what David Icke was also saying about prisoners, controlling each other and stopping each other from escape. This prisoner who was fresh to the fight, should have re-energized the other prisoners, but it did not. Instead they now almost view him as an enemy and why? For trying to achieve the same goals they had tried to achieve?

It’s like this experiment with monkey’s. You put them in a cell. Place a banana, and then spray them each time they try to get the banana. Eventually they stop trying, and start attacking other monkey’s who are trying to get the banana, even when you stop spraying them they do the same thing. Even if you take out a couple of monkey’s and put in a couple of new ones, they will still attack the new ones, and they don’t even understand why, even without the water spraying the monkeys, and then in time the new one’s also learn to not go after the banana. It’s sounds almost insane, but that is exactly where we are in society. This is the part that I am still trying to grasp.

[quote]At this point it became clear that we had to end the study. We had created an overwhelmingly powerful situation — a situation in which prisoners were withdrawing and behaving in pathological ways, and in which some of the guards were behaving sadistically. Even the “good” guards felt helpless to intervene, and none of the guards quit while the study was in progress. Indeed, it should be noted that no guard ever came late for his shift, called in sick, left early, or demanded extra pay for overtime work.[/quote]

Ofcourse those in society who are benefiting from this sickness, have no reason for poor health or to be ill affected. While the others who see it for what it is and who are suffering, have all the complaints.

[quote]
I ended the study prematurely for two reasons. First, we had learned through videotapes that the guards were escalating their abuse of prisoners in the middle of the night when they thought no researchers were watching and the experiment was “off.” Their boredom had driven them to ever more pornographic and degrading abuse of the prisoners.

Second, Christina Maslach, a recent Stanford Ph.D. brought in to conduct interviews with the guards and prisoners, strongly objected when she saw our prisoners being marched on a toilet run, bags over their heads, legs chained together, hands on each other’s shoulders. Filled with outrage, she said, “It’s terrible what you are doing to these boys!” Out of 50 or more outsiders who had seen our prison, she was the only one who ever questioned its morality. Once she countered the power of the situation, however, it became clear that the study should be ended. [/quote]

It does not take much to bring out man’s inhumanity to man does it? Reminds me of Lord of the Flies. The other interesting part is that of all the outsiders that came and went, the parents, priests and others, none ever demanded that a stop be put to the experiment, it was just this one person who saw what was wrong and questioned it, that helped bring things to an end.

Well not unlike this experiment and McCarthyism, it does not take much to snap society back to reality. Eg. In the prison experiment, someone comes in questions it, and that helps to put an end to the experiment. I think that’s when the exterminator begins to snap out of it, and realise that he’s become a little too caught up. Same with Mccarthyism. Apparently a news caster Edward R. Murrow, played a big role in getting society to see what a lying, devious, fink the senator was and that helped to break his hold on society. Not before a lot of damage was done, but it helped.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bb4ul_gJ2Hc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X_uTbVfDtgI

Hypothetical

The following is reposted by request. It ‘s a record of a forum conversation conducted some months ago regarding gang stalking/Covert Investigations that has now been removed. The following was a “hypothetical conversation” between GS, and BB another poster.

 

 

BB-

 

1. I was talking to a friend about all the posts concerning Gang Stalking and community policing, and we came up with these things that we think may help counter the stalking.

2. (Intended For entertainment purposes only, and on the assumption such a thing as Gang Stalking exists of course, so don’t take any of this seriously).

He he he he.

 

3. Have friends sign up for community policing, so you have some one on the inside.

4. Walk your block, any were you can have a good vantage point of the area, is were they will be, so if you see some one there, it will probably be them. (Identifying, them is half the battle).

5. Bug your own car, in case they set you up, use voice or sound activated tape recorders when ever you can, like in your home. If some one comes in while you are out, you now have a voice. Carry one under your shirt.

6. Start your own data base; always have a camera or video with you ALLWAYS. Record possible faces and cars. (You could say you are making a movie or you are an artist as a reason for always being seen taking pictures of cars and people).

7. Lead them to areas were you know there is not much traffic or people, have a friend hide with a video cam, to catch the car plates and the people in the cares if he/she can.

8. (Call the friend from a pay phone).

9. If you are set up, take as many of them to jail with you as you can (set them up, he he he just kidding). If you can’t figure who set them on you, them implicate your known enemies, as drug dealers or rats or other. If you go down when they go through your computer or diary, and there is the names of the locals you think may be involved; now they are in the hot seat to.

10. Get a friend to call and find out were they meet and collect as much info as possible.

11. Have your lawyer ask if the accuser, or accusers, are, or have ever been, a part of community policing, and if they have ever been told to follow or monitor you, then lead to how often and how many people involved. (to show stalking).

12. Freedom of information form can be filled out by your lawyer, ask to see if the local police have ever had you under surveillance, for how long, how many involved, and if community policing was used. And why.

13. Place small peaces of paper on top of your door when you close it or tie a hair across it, or place a small breakable fuse under door mats when you leave to see if they have been disturbed when you get back home.

14. Spread pepper to through dogs of from smelling around or in your home, the basement in particular.

15. Keep a diary, and make burn CDs of all video and pictures you have of them. Make lots of copies, and mail or email them to your self or friends to keep.

16. Have more than one email address.

17. When possible have other people use you computer, (with in reason), if anything is planted by the stalkers now you are not the only one that has used it.

18. Call work (payphone) take the occasional impromptu long drive late Sunday.

You don’t have to go to work they do, and they (probably as many as four cars) will all have to pay gas. (Gets expensive for volunteers).

19. Bike up one way streets, (just kidding that is eligal and dangerous, dont do it, he he he) this annoys them when they are in cars, or take your bike in the trunk then pull over lock your car then bike.

20. When they stalk you in cars they will run a box type pattern, two or three will get in front of you and then one will split to the left and right to monitor if you turn right or left one will stay in front and one will be behind you by a few blocks. You are now boxed in no matter what direction you turn. Exhaust them and there gas and resources by walking or driving a few docks in one direction then go back then reverse it, you travel less than they do they spend money.

21. When you see one of them approach them, and ask for the time, or start a conversation there friends will gather, but they are not supposed to talk to you as they may find out you are innocent and this will cause them to question there superiors, and there operation could be jeopardized.

22. If they cause you to loose your job, then you have complete control over the hours you sleep and were you go, make them follow you at three or four in the morning then switch your sleeping pattern.

23. Condition them to expect certain behavior (walk at the same time every day, go to the same coffee shop), then when you need to you can throw them a curve.

24. Be around people as much as possible.

25. Get a police background check done on your self, it costs about $25.00 then when it comes back clear use it to try to join community policing, (now they cant say they did not know you were innocent and not a criminal, in court this is a good tool).

26. Have friends get the police check done and have them join community policing, so you have inside information to confirm you are being stalked.

27. Do volunteer work in the community to improve you image and to cause the stalkers to doubt why they are stalking someone that is helping the community. And to be around people and to stay sane.

28. Don’t be a victim; use your imagination to set them up and to expose them. Dont assume there is no counter to Gang Stalking, if it was invented by man it can be broken or counterd by man.

 

Don’t take any of this seriously it is all hypothetical and not intended as advise of any kind. As we all know Gang Stalking does not exist. He he he he.

 

 

 

GS-

Thank you for the hypothetical suggestions.

 

Yeah well apparently gang stalking does not exist, from what I can see it was set up as disinformation to lead targets astray from these stupid insidious Cointelpro type investigations that are happening to innocent people in society.

 

They threw in just enough truth to make it feasable, so that when targets go to the police, who fully know what’s happening, and start complaining about gang stalking, they get their butt’s kicked, or get termed crazy, or whatever.

 

You have a covert investigation, where there people friends, families, employers, landlords etc, are contacted and told God know’s what about these people, and then they get asked to spy on you. Also with the community civilian snitches, who use their little Stasi signal to communicate. (How appropriate.)

 

If I had known when this junk first began that that was what was going on, I could have gone straight to a lawyer, and said hey look, this is what seems to be going on, can you do anything? Instead I had to spend months looking into this, to try to figure out what is happening to the targets.

 

People like David Lawson who wrote terrorist stalking in America are either government agents spreading disinfo, or just really stupid. Considering the term gang stalking did not come along until after his first book, and now they seem to be trying to fade out the term it’s so irritating.

 

From what I read about Kilmeer Gill, you know that Montreal shooter, it sounds like he might have been under watch for over 6 years. Things that were written in his blog, sound like this, and if that’s the case, they might have driven him to a state where he was capable of hurting those people. I think the actions of these covert investigation are criminal themselves. Just like Cointelpro was criminal and conducted by the government, it’s the same thing, but now they are using civilian spies to help ruin the lives of innocent people.

 

Do you know how many people are taking part in this, who don’t know the harm they are doing to others, or the roles they are really playing? I think that the media have a responsibillity to report this stuff, and to do investigative documentaries about this stuff, but just like during the McCarthy era, they won’t, and more innocent people will just get destroyed. It saddens me to realise that we are once again in such at time period.

 

With people trying to sensor this information. It really makes me very angry, that someone would censor information on something that is affecting innocent people. People have a right to know, and they trust the media to tell them.

Toronto Star 

 

At least some of the truth is getting through, but it’s a shame that more media people are not stepping up to the plate and trying to do the right thing. Whatever that is in our new survellence, snitch society, where everyone monitors everyone else.

 

 

BB-

What you say about Kilmeer Gill sounds possible, he did say he wanted to get away but that they wouldn’t let him, or something like that.

He sounded like he could have been Gang Stalked to the breaking point.

 

I don’t understand why people don’t legislate for:

 

1. Them to have identification displayed that could be easily seen from a distance for the safety of the people they follow and assume guilty, and for the safety of the general public, and the volunteers them self’s.

2. I am asking what safeguards are in place for the public, to show there is no abuse of power by the COPP type programs.

3. What is in place to stop them (COPP) targeting Natives or others, based on a bias or the word of someone with a grudge or even on the word of a cop.

4. Where are the neutral third parties and the transparency for the public to observe?

And question and watch them at will.

5. Where or at what point are the people targeted allowed to see the evidence against them and to disprove it to the COPP, Gang Stalkers?

6. What is the Government doing to be held accountable for the safety of the citizens on patrol volunteers, and the people they may follow, or Stalk, on behalf of the police (Hypothetical example).

7. Why are there no limits to the length of Stalking time to avoided disasters? Kilmeer Gill as possible example you have given. If the police have to have programs like COPP to Stalk or harass people for them then there should be a limit of two weeks or months. After that the police should do there own work, or have CSIS do it for them.

 

 

Have the COPP programs set them selves up as judge, jury, and executioner?

Inventing evidence when none is there to justify there existence?

 

The COPP programs volunteers would not be told that they are harassing innocent people, and most would not question there authority figures. They would simply be unaware that what they are being asked to do, is legal (hence the need for no identification on cars or persons).

Nor would they need to know they could be the cause of someone snapping or committing suicide, as you saw this is a real possibility. I guess it would all depend on how fanatical there leader is. All this is a possibility, so what precautions are in place?

 

And the problem comes when they start stalking people that are not criminals, but that may have been out spoken either against police or government or other groups.

Even a good person can be painted as a criminal when they (COPP programs) choose to use these tactics, with police backing.

I am not saying that this is the case, but Is this Russia are they the COPP programs against people having the right to answer to what ever COPP has accused them of, that may have caused the Gang Stalking in the first place?

 

What safeguards are in place by the Government for the public, to show there is no abuse of power by the COPP programs?

 

It they were to “gang stalk” people on behalf of the police or other force (just an example you understand).

I would think it would be dangerous to them, as most criminals are a little paranoid to begin with. Having them (alleged criminals) “gang stalked” on behalf of the police, would place them the citizens on patrol in danger, as they may be mistaken for other criminals or gang members.

Are these people required by the Government to wear easily seen identification on there cars and persons at all times?

Have the police ever gotten the citizens on patrol to follow or “Gang Stalk” people under a presumption of guilt rather than actual guilt?

After all the RCMP fiascos can we afford not to ask these questions and have safe guards put in place?

All of this is just wild speculation and rumor of course.

Why has no one tried to get inside there groups and expose them?

Why has no one tried to write a book outlining some of there tactics. And measures to counter there tactics (it would be a hell of a money maker).

All of this is just wild speculation and rumor of course, based on the assumption that such a thing as Gang Stalking by police sponsored vigilante type groups exists.

 

 

GS- Here is some more information on Gill and why I think he really was a target of this practice, and I think this is what lead to the shooting in Montreal. This is why I think what I do, and this is why I would like to see more media information about this.

 

The Trench Coat

 

For those with a short memory you might remember that Kimveer Gill was the young Montreal man who went on a shooting spree several months ago killing at least 1 person and wounding at least a dozen others.

 

Most people just wrote him off as a nut case who was into video games and mixed up fantasy with reality, a goth who hated society. For those of us who stopped to read some of his postings to gain clues to what might have happened, there is an angle that has not been discussed, that has not been talked about.

 

Here are some of his blog postings that I found really interesting.

 

Dated September 12, 2006

 

[quote]Stop Bullying

 

It?s not only the bully?s fault you know!!

It?s the teachers and principals fault for turning a blind eye, just cuz it?s not their job. You *uckers are pathetic.

It?s the police?s fault for not doing anything when people conplain (oops, my mistake, the cops are corrupt sons of whores, so it?s not like they can do anything about it.)

 

*UCK THE POLICE

 

It?s society?s fault for acting like it?s normal for people to be assholes to each other. Society disgusts me.

It?s everyone?s fault for being so apathetic towards *ucking everything that doesn?t affect them personally. *UCK YOU SOCIETY.

[/quote]

 

It sounds like his bullying, which is what he called it, might have involved trying to get the police to do something, but it sounds like they not only did not do anything about the bullying, they also he ends with calling them corrupt. Why?

 

Not so outside the realm of what you might find in many other bullying cases, but here is something that is particularly interesting.

 

[quote]I wonder why my household has been under surveillance by law enforcement for 6 years now? Makes no sense to me!!

 

Oh, you?re wondering how I know?

lol

Bet you little monkeys are

Hey, assholes!!

Everything everyone says or does against me is shown to me in my dreams, I see everything. You *ucking monkeys.

 

God, you humans are so inferior.

[/quote]

 

 

 

The above is taken from the trench coat site, where they have his blog postings. Now the last post was the one I found the most interesting, when doing research on this. Trying to understand if in fact the actions of others, did in part lead to the situation in Montreal, and if so what can be done to prevent it and avoid it in future.

 

 

I am wondering what guidelines there are in place for things like this, but after reading about Mahar Arar and the bs the CSIS and RCMP pulled, I realized there is no one moral at the gate. I mean they realised the man was innocent and did nothing to change the perception of his guilt and were willing to let him rot in some country where he was being tortured, and part of why he was on some list had more to do with who he had associated with in the past.

 

CBC

 

[quote]Zaccardelli says he first learned that the Mounties had passed erroneous information about Arar on to U.S authorities after a public inquiry report was released by Justice Dennis O’Connor in the fall of 2006. In September that year, Zaccardelli told a parliamentary committee that he had learned of the RCMP’s mistake shortly after Arar’s deportation to Syria in 2002. [/quote]

 

From what I understand after ralising that the RCMP was corrupt, they created CSIS only to have the same corruption happen all over again.

 

They knew they had passed on false information and did nothing to correct it, if anything they did the opposite. These are the people we are suppose to trust, to protect us and the rights of innocent citizens.

 

 

[quote]RCMP Commissioner Giuliano Zaccardelli breaks more than a week of silence on Maher Arar’s ordeal, apologizing for the “nightmare” that arose when the Mounties wrongly linked him to terrorism. Speaking before the House of Commons security committee, Zaccardelli denies that the government muzzled him from speaking earlier on the case and insists he will not step down as commissioner over the affair.

 

Several critics have called for Zaccardelli’s resignation following the revelation of the RCMP’s blunders, detailed in O’Connor’s report on the investigation.

 

[/quote]

 

The same thing happens in these covert investigations. I can see why they are opened in secret to an extent, but based on extensive conversations with people that are being harassed in this way, there is a lot being done to set them up so that they can look and come across as crazy. Wither it’s them being batted in public, so they can have an angry outburst, to them having their home entered and stuff moved around, or other small things that make them sound collectively crazy it’s the same thing, and there is seemingly no reason for it.

 

The other thing is some of these people are whistle-blowers, minorities, and single woman, people that are marginalized or independent, the type that for whatever reason the government has decided to go after. There are people that I have talked to that have said that this has been going on for 10 years, 15 years, 20 years. How inefficient would you have to be, that you need 20 years to determine if someone is a criminal, crazy, terrorist, whatever lie you are making up? Honestly.

 

There does not seem to be any moral force governing this, and from what I can see, have observed, and confirmed with others, the police are fully corporation with making these people sound like they are crazy when they go to the police. Eg. The police are aware of these eyes and ears programs, when I spoke to one office he had in his division 5 reports of stalking of this specific nature. The reports were apparently all from single females, and yet he was writing them off as paranoid. (These community officers know about this program, because they are the ones who are in charge of it for the various divisions, just to give you an idea.)

 

From what I can see it seems that a large part of society is going along with the snitching and civilian spying, but not necessarily the brightest part of society, or the cleanest. What I mean is, I have seen some people that I am pretty sure are criminal elements, who acting as civilian spies, and I am so grossed out by that. I mean snitches will sell their mothers out for money, why not innocent people?

 

Since this is being used to target certain primary groups, what you have said about this being used as a revenge service has a lot of merit. To this date, there is no clear guideline that I have been able to find to the length of time a covert investigation can be ongoing for, the guidelines for incidents getting reported. Eg. I mentioned targets being set up by some of these snitches/civilian spies.

 

 

[quote]1. Them to have identification displayed that could be easily seen from a distance for the safety of the people they follow and assume guilty, and for the safety of the general public, and the volunteers them self’s.

2. I am asking what safeguards are in place for the public, to show there is no abuse of power by the COPP type programs.

3. What is in place to stop them (COPP) targeting Natives or others, based on a bias or the word of someone with a grudge or even on the word of a cop.

4. Where are the neutral third parties and the transparency for the public to observe?

And question and watch them at will.

5. Where or at what point are the people targeted allowed to see the evidence against them and to disprove it to the COPP, Gang Stalkers?

6. What is the Government doing to be held accountable for the safety of the citizens on patrol volunteers, and the people they may follow, or Stalk, on behalf of the police (Hypothetical example).

7. Why are there no limits to the length of Stalking time to avoided disasters? Kilmeer Gill as possible example you have given. If the police have to have programs like COPP to Stalk or harass people for them then there should be a limit of two weeks or months. After that the police should do there own work, or have CSIS do it for them.

[/quote]

 

1. See they are suppose to be just average citizens while out on the road, they act as the eyes and ears of society, so for the snitching purpose of this, giving them identification would not work. The other problem is because there is no id, anyone and I do mean anyone can take advantage of this. If I am aware of this, who else is? Skin heads, KKK, can you imagine them baiting a target, then several of their friends reporting the incident of the crazy target? Hitlers Brown Coats, use to do this to the Jews in WWII so they could make them act out and get arrested, and now we have this in our society.

 

2. There are no safeguards from what I can see, because if the target of this can not give their feedback or input, then it’s completely bogus. Eg. Even when targets file police reports, the police reports are often not filed, or purposely twisted around to make the target look crazy. Also with the baiting, the target never get’s to explain why they got angry or yelled at someone. Guilty because some corrupt people say so, and the target get’s no input, and from what I can see, there are people purposely baiting targets, with the blessing of the people in charge. (From what I can see.)

 

3. There is nothing to stop them, and based on who is getting targeted, it looks like they are one step ahead of you with choosing whom to target. Society already has the police racial profiling people this is just one more way for them to do it and long term, until someones life is destroyed. There is no time line for these investigations.

 

4. Not only that, but if you suspect you are under investigation, there is no place to go, and no party to turn to. Amnesty will not help with this, and most lawyers can not discuss this, because how many have also agreed to be the eyes and ears of the state? So targets are left with no resources to clear their names. And since the media will also do nothing to help, most don’t know what exactly is happening to them.

 

5. They are never allowed to see the evidence against them. Just like Guantanamo Bay, So there could be tons of erroneous bs, and all the target know is maybe they can’t get an apartment, or find a job, or people are mean or rude to them, but they have no idea why. The ultimate way to black ball and black list someone, and where is the media to help them? Nowhere.

 

6. I don’t know about that, but if Gill was a target of this, then they should be charged equally with the death of that girl. You can not do something so inhuman to someone and then wonder at the outcome. We now recognise this in bullying and the connection to school shootings. We need to acknowledge this as well. I think the thing with these investigations is that some targets will kill themselves, others, go to jail, become homeless, or be institutionalised, and if only a small percentage is damaged every year, it does not appear that bad.

 

Videos: Cointelpro.

 

1. Youtube

 

2. Youtube

 

3. Youtube

 

4. Youtube

 

 

7. Because from the research that I have been able to find, and from talking to others, just like with Cointelpro investigations, the goal is to destroy the target. They did this to Martin Luther King Jr. People have to understand that governments do bad things. If the media would do their jobs, then this would be understood.

 

They tried to destroy that man, and when that failed, they targeted him for termination, and a month later he was assassinated.

 

ICDC

 

 

[quote]Have the COPP programs set them selves up as judge, jury, and executioner? Inventing evidence when none is there to justify there existence? [/quote]

 

I think the people running this have set themselves up to be just that, since there is no input from the target. How in a democratic society can you be declared guilty without seeing the evidence against you, and have you life so interfered with. I mean these people will contact everyone in a targets life with the same lies, and ask or force them to go along with the spying. Every store a target goes into, they are exposed as someone who needs watching wither it’s true or not.

 

Exactly. Inventing evidence to justify their existence. If they can show that we have a bunch of unstable, criminal, terrorist people in society, then it’s funding for them. It’s reason for their existence. There is no one saying hey wait a second, how do we know it’s true? Cointelpro all over again.

 

[quote]The COPP programs volunteers would not be told that they are harassing innocent people, and most would not question there authority figures. They would simply be unaware that what they are being asked to do, is legal (hence the need for no identification on cars or persons).

Nor would they need to know they could be the cause of someone snapping or committing suicide, as you saw this is a real possibility. I guess it would all depend on how fanatical there leader is. All this is a possibility, so what precautions are in place?

[/quote]

 

Exactly. Then you get a term like gang stalking and it just confuses things. Eg. The target goes looking for answers and via the term gang stalking, they are told it’s these evil vigilante types that are committing this stuff. They know themselves to be innocent so of course they believe that it’s vigilantes.

 

Meanwhile the people doing the stalking, sorry civilian spying, see about 15 minutes of the targets life. So they really do believe they are stalking someone who is crazy, a criminal, danger to society, whatever lie they have been told. A lot of them are just trying to be good citizens.

 

So you have two world’s colliding. The target who is followed and harassed every freaking day gets it. They feel victimized, and they have no place to turn for help or assistance. They become a creature with their back to the wall, most will eventually come out fighting.

 

The civilian spies might be told to jiggle keys at someone every time the subway announcement is read out, while someone else none partial observes the behaviour. (This is how it’s suppose to be neutral and none partial, and fair.) What they don’t see, is the little trouble maker who tried to shove the keys in someones face, and upset them just 10 minutes later. Thus they get angry because they are acutely aware that they are being harassed and they don’t like it.

 

So from the targets point of view they are getting harassed, from the person who is observing this, the target is acting irrational. Cause they don’t see the people who tried to trip the target, while the other jangled keys in front of them yesterday. Etc. This goes on, and they take the input of the person doing the observation and the civilian spies. So it all looks neutral. I mean 7 civilian spies who don’t know the target are not going to make up a lie right? If they don’t have the whole picture, then yes that is what they are doing inadvertently, and it’s shame. A lot of the civilian spies are not bad people. They think they are helping the country.

 

I mean they don’t any better. They are asked to observe someone for 15 minutes, they see them flipping out, they file a report, and they never ask or question the events that came before it.

 

[quote]And the problem comes when they start stalking people that are not criminals, but that may have been out spoken either against police or government or other groups.

Even a good person can be painted as a criminal when they (COPP programs) choose to use these tactics, with police backing.

I am not saying that this is the case, but Is this Russia are they the COPP programs against people having the right to answer to what ever COPP has accused them of, that may have caused the Gang Stalking in the first place? [/quote]

 

 

In Russia they used this on activists and dissidents all the time to make them look mentally ill, so they could lock them away.

 

The other problem is they are using criminal elements to be the extra set of eyes and ears. So you have low lives, also helping to stalk innocent people. Clearly I don’t have to paint this picture for you.

 

 

[quote]What safeguards are in place by the Government for the public, to show there is no abuse of power by the COPP programs? [/quote]

 

In the research that I have done over the last 10 months I have found nothing. The police will not talk about the investigations or how someone get’s off the list. (I have been able to get that far, but stalled with the investigations unit.) The RCMP have a complaint process, but it’s for a complaint against a specific agent or person.

 

Since targets don’t have names, or a clear info about which division is doing what, who is heading stuff up, it’s really hard. Also since the police are lying about this, it’s almost impossible. Very few will admit to the program and very few will try to do anything to help targets. Most will flat out lie and say there is no such thing. (Harder for them, since the article came out, but they do still try.)

 

[quote]Have the police ever gotten the citizens on patrol to follow or “Gang Stalk” people under a presumption of guilt rather than actual guilt?

[/quote]

 

I think we all know the answer to this question. You have some really good questions, and you understand this really well. Hypothetically of course.

 

[quote]After all the RCMP fiascos can we afford not to ask these questions and have safe guards put in place?

[/quote]

 

No the truth is, we can not afford to, but yet we do anyways.

 

[quote]Why has no one tried to get inside there groups and expose them?

Why has no one tried to write a book outlining some of there tactics. And measures to counter there tactics (it would be a hell of a money maker).

[/quote]

 

The problem is as a target, you will not be asked to be a civilian spy, so you have to use those investigative journalist skills to find out any details.

 

Phones bugged, acquaintances all of them contacted, so they are all sworn to secrecy, and most do keep their mouths shut. Only a few targets have been lucky enough to have good friends clue them in.

 

I agree with the book idea, but because of what David Lawson did with his book, it might make targets look questionable.

 

[quote]Stalking by police sponsored vigilante type groups exists.[/quote]

 

Remember they don’t call it state sponsored stalking. They call it being an extra set of eyes and ears. It’s so nice the PC terms being used. I guess to call it the means of driving your fellow citizens to suicide, mass slaughter, institutionalization, jail, or homelessness, just does not have the same ring to it.